brent metcalfe excommunicated10 marca 2023
Hibbard later had a dream in which he again. I am quite sure, that film is no longer shown. Would that fit the time frame the book is given in? The Version table provides details related to the release that this issue/RFE will be addressed. Will there be more? And theres no way that you can change it. Brent Metcalfe, Sue's husband of 23 years, is doing everything he can to support both Sue and Samantha. Great interview. D&C 76:2021). All of these documents are available on the Joseph Smith Papers Project website. Azerbaijan's Jabrayil Hasanov in action against The USA's Brent Metcalf. This was an excellent broadcast! What an amazing life Brent! Cultural Context Preceding the Book of Mormon. [9][4], After being fired from his job in security for the LDS Church for his writings, Metcalfe worked first for Steve Christensen and later for Mark Hofmann. There is a newish movement who rejects that the book of mormon ever occurred in South America. When I was on my mission in the early 70s, we were encouraged to show a film called Ancient America Speaks. He had not let on that the 7th East Press was his brainchild. So, so good. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Has been quite a while since you had a podcast that wasnt left of center. I believe Brent said he has the copy in his records.**. The interview was superb and the insight into this extraordinary life was gifted. Looking forward to the interview! My good friend Matt Christensen digitized the 7th East Press and was kind enough to allow Signature Books to make it available on their incredible digital library. They have shown time and time again that that is all that matters to them. Now that the new Netflix documentary Murder Among the Mormons has come out, it also validates the important witness that Brent was in this event. Brent Metcalf (born July 14, 1986) is an American freestyle wrestler who formerly competed in the international circuit for the United States of America. In fact, it may just be possible that I stood right next to Brent during our official kick off meeting, when Elbert invited his brother Lyle to give us all a magic show. St. Martins Press. saw heaven open, and Jesus at the right hand of God, and the Heavenly hosts surrounding the throne, adoring the Father and the Son in the most sublime strains, (Hibbard, _Memoirs_, 181; cf. Copyright 2005 - 2023 | Mormon Stories. Brents words deepened my own thoughts on God, spiritually and humanity. [9] Metcalfe and the police were afraid Metcalfe might be a future target he went into hiding. Thats what I expected from church leaders.I meanSalamander spirit !! Brent did a marvelous job of creating a context by which these events took place. 1) In your opinion, which group is currently winning in their arguments regarding the truth claims of church, the critics or the apologetics? My epiphany also came suddenly, while driving, followed by a massive emotional experience. I just saw the Netflix Documentary last night. Sincerely, Terry. I also wanted to tell you how disturbed I became to my very core about the way you were treated during your working for the church Then the description of the events of day of the bombings, where the meeting was still set with the GA! Biography [ edit] As a prep wrestler, Metcalf went undefeated with a career record of 228-0, won four consecutive Michigan state titles, and earned six junior national titles. OMAHA, Neb. You can have a PhD and still not have great knowledge. Why are they so adamant about excommunicating someone who has a different opinion than they do? I have heard that Mac Christianson financed the mission of one of Hofmanns sons. and our Metcalfe believed that his firing was because of a few people in church leadership who perceived him as a threat, even though he viewed his own work as apologetic and not scholarly. This doesn't mean that Metcalfe has accurately translated that theory into his study of things Mormon. Please, God, let this podcast inspire someone to produce a talk show called, Hot-tubbing with Mark Hoffman! In these two episodes we discuss: The aftermath of the Mark Hofmann bombings, and Brent's excommunication for his research into the Book of Mormon, and. Yet a solid and detailed examination oflhe pre suppositions, methods, arguments, and conclusions of the vari ous readings of the Book of Mormon would still be very use Well also talk in depth with Brent about how he has been able to construct a healthy and happy life outside of Mormonism. Talk about ADD. Whatever the reasons, thanks again for your research that revealed there was MTSTWIS (More-To-See-Than-What-I-Saw). :). I felt like somehow I was responsible for what had happened. A scene from John Dehlin's upcoming disciplinary council, probably. Brent Metcalf Resides in Modesto, CA Includes Address (1) Phone (1) See Results Statistics for all 3 Brent Metcalf results: 50 yrs AVERAGE AGE 100% are in their 50s, while the average age is 50. Growing up as a full believer, Brent followed the conventional routine and did the missions, after which he spent a lot of time in the historical archives of the Church, researching documents and working with the security department. "[7] William J. Hamblin responded specifically to an article by Metcalfe. I think we ought to be okay with these questions, and not automatically defensive. And it leaves this distrust in LDS leaders hanging with the viewer. I know about the September 6 and there are others. Broad topics include my excommunication plus BoMor and BoAbr research. On Wiwikipedia, it mentions that in a hit piece done by Dan Peterson, that he encodeds the message, Metcalfe is a butthead. What were your qurarrels like with FARMS? Brent Metcalf, who has been through personal tragedy, triumph and uncertainty can now call himself a national champion. Powered by WordPress.com VIP. We also talk about the concept of translation, Joseph Smiths views on his translations, the traditional apologetic responses concerning the Book of Abraham (Hugh Nibley, John Gee, and Kerry Muhlestein), as well as the LDS Churchs recent essay on the Book of Abraham. You seem to be back on your game of simply inviting your guests to tell their stories. Joseph didnt go like a lamb to the slaughter in burning down personal property he broke the law in a major way. But before Brent could truly move on, he had to deal with the emotional turmoil of knowing that he was associated with Mark Hofmann. This negative sentiment is perhaps made up for by Hofmann's victims. What scenario for the books origins have you constructed over your many years of study? What about your book did the church find cause to excommunicate you? I was a newly returned missionary at BYU when all of this took place. Ack! Riveting stuff. but he threw out the baby with the bath water as if the success of Christianity rode on the success of Joseph Smith.. Thanks again Brent for sharing a sketch of your life with us. What academic qualifications does Mr. Metcalfe have to authoritatively speak on subjects like the historicity of the Book of Abraham? Thank You for contributing your experiences with us all I am curious this morning about the possibility of any reports during the time JS says he had his First Vision, that were published in local newspapers, town Crier printings? Release Calendar Top 250 Movies Most Popular Movies Browse Movies by Genre Top Box Office Showtimes & Tickets Movie News India Movie Spotlight. Brent Lee Metcalfe is an independent researcher and writer of the Latter Day Saint Movement. In this fascinating conversation Brent details that while working for Church security he was working on scholarly endeavors that he hoped would help contribute to apologitic defenses of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Or even presenting the center view? Also, make sure your second recording matches the first. All he had to say publicly if there was really no truth in it, was its simply not true and leave it at that. We hope to rerecord sometime next week. Thanks for this podcast! My life has been enriched by theinquiries those books catalyzed. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. All rights reserved. Why didnt the church just pay for their own documents? Growing up in the Eleventh Ward, you seemed very different than the Terry, Larry and Scott group. Oh. Jn Oh, that would be great! Ultimately, Id say (and I dont know that youd fundamentally disagree here) that its impossible to separate traditions like Catholicism or Mormonism from their fundamental and unique truth claims. Why do you think the church is so fearful, silencing members and burying facts ? The Book of Abraham was a problem on my mission too, but we had to just ignore that issue, and wait for an answer. John in wonderfully rare form in this oneI love it! Some people who study and read deeply can be more expert than others with advanced degrees. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. During my 7779 mission I served in two London areas, living first in Kilburn Park and later in Wimbledon. Thanks for the clarification. Rude Dog Never fear! I have some insights into that. [4] Metcalfe had become an ardent supporter of the counterfeited Salamander letter, and hired by Christensen to research the letter. Thank you for this interview. All rights reserved. We may be on our own and need to create our own justice and future, but its possible that Providence does in fact sometimes intervene. Im was left kind of hot but dry after hoping to hear about his drama with the church and its leaders.any chance of allowing closure for me here? Im not saying you need to have spiritual experiences to validate your work by any means if the facts are facts, but a higher power confirmation always helps. This unleashed a veritable deluge of Catholic contributions to modern biblical scholarship. In 1539 he was elected as an MP for the rst time and was appointed to serve in the King's Privy Chamber. I just wish that I could undo everything. Despite this, though, Brent found the courage to keep his head held high and began delving deep into the issues surrounding the Book of Mormon, a topic that he had been looking to examine since the early 1980s. Shortly after returning home and leaving the church he was very active in Sunstone and various things of that nature, but has since moved on with his life and seems very happy with a small family of his own running a small restaurant he and his older brother own together. I am still cringing from the realizations about the lack of discernment and the deliberate efforts on the part of the GAs. Learn how your comment data is processed. Hoffman was Laffertys cell mate. In Gnosticism Abraham is not even a real person, the story represents the triumph of spirit over matter and is loaded with hidden symbolic meaning. Without good research, ours is a heritage shallow in meaning. He did so to prevent members from apostatizing and becoming fundamentalists. 497: Brent Metcalfe Part 3 -- After the Hofmann bombings and his excommunication (2014 Podcast Episode) Plot Showing all 0 items Jump to: Summaries It looks like we don't have any Plot Summaries for this title yet. Brent is a fascinating interview for Mormon Stories for many reasons, including: He knew forger and bomber Mark Hofmann personally. Or at least, Lets Take this Puppy Down.. Truth or legend? Its a pity Joseph Smith couldnt sit them all down for a good coming-to-Jesus admonishing. Brents work is groundbreaking and reliably fascinating. I thought your essay in New Approaches was excellent, and certainly complicates traditional understandings of the Book of Mormon; you obviously dont believe the BoM is historical in any way, but Id also guess you would acknowledge the impressive complexity of it. Also, I appreciate you bringing up ADD. She was in the middle of her frustrations with the MTC (and some of you know the story). Nicely done, John. In another post Ill comment on the Mark Hoffman affair. Why didnt the Lord reveal to the the prophet that Hofmann was going to kill? On acquiring a PhD, after a year of university, apart from a lack of finances, I quickly noticed that the degree factory isnt a reflection on ones intelligence. Until Vatican II, many scholars felt hamstrung by the churchs dogma on the Bible and related theological issues. Its great to find all this background information. I was only 8 when Steve died, so I just remember his smiling face and that everyone, especially my parents, just loved him. Indeed, the trivial matters that many theists assert as claiming the attention of God (even as hell is meanwhilebreaking loose) is absurd evidently too absurd for many to even grasp. In secret, behind closed doors, who were they really betting on? Metcalfe (ed. I am very excited to announce that I will soon be interviewing Brent Metcalfe. Elbert once quipped, The Open Door Club has become the 7th East Press!. Brent Metcalfe. brent metcalfe excommunicated. Those mind-opening essays impacted my life in positive and powerful ways. Its probably best to start over when these things happen, rather than just continuing where you left off. I just discovered this on my own I bought every single issue of the 7th East Press, and was so disappointed that I missed picking up the final April Fools issue which appeared around campus after the edict banning it from being sold on campus. Hinckley never responded, but was shortly thereafter offered the job by Christensen, which Metcalfe felt was orchestrated by Hinckley. Near the end of a presentation you gave for the ExMormon Foundation, you said something to the effect of: People ask me how Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon, how he pulled it off, how it all came about. But being new to the church and so unacquainted with church matters and such things I was not much help. Many years later in his interview with Dehlin, Brent Metcalfe tells of a conversation that he had with Mark E. Peterson where he plainly admits he was lying in his book. It instead discusses the fact that the LDS Church keeps some documents secret. Lex, the recommendation by Andrew is a good resource. For the listeners who are curious, a portion of the book describes a first vision, copied below: https://play.google.com/books/reader?printsec=frontcover&output=reader&id=XH0rAAAAYAAJ&pg=GBS.PA54, The Lamb once slain appeared to my understanding, and while viewing him, I felt such love to him as I never felt to anything earthly. Serious insight and analysis of the religion Im trying to fit into my new, authentic life. Brent did Jerald make an official overture to church leadership regarding Hofmann being a fraud? Isnt that a dangerous and at least weak and anything goes approach, especially for fanatical groups? On my mission in England I met a older, wise non LDS woman very knowledgeable on esoteric and metaphysics teachings. :). They buried the Mclellin diaries also.similar thingdidnt like the content. I was curious about the book that Brent photocopied from the archives. Liked by Brent Metcalfe Experience Practice Lead - Mergers and Acquisitions/Investment Group and Consultant Backswath Management Sep 2022 - Present6 months Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Seeking New. Brenten "Brent" Metcalfe joined NW3C after working in law enforcement for over 13 years. 2005, page 147, 180, Sillitoe, L., & Roberts, A. D. (1988). It was fascinating and enlightening to see the underbelly of ongoings between church leaders and members. What do you attribute this decline to? That said, I have to wonder what planet hes living on when he says that Catholicism has been reinvigorated in the post Vatican II era. :( Will re-record hopefully soon! In episode #276 of The Jimmy Rex Show, we sit down with a key role in Netflix Documentary Murder Among The Mormons, Brent Metcalfe.Visit and Listen to more. Twitter. But such intellectual issues didnt play a role in my failure of faith. The church history claims there was a great uproar about this youth that claimed to have a vision of God. Once you start to deconstruct Mormonism, the next step is Christianity, and then the existence of a god, or not There are plenty of stops along that road to hang your hat, but the fastest growing belief system around the existence of god, is atheism. (I think that was my only disappointment, that Brent basically gave up on God because of an epiphany.). Brent Metcalf. In other words, if it is an intrinsic aspect of a tradition to make historical claims or assertions about the underlying nature of the world, the falsification of those claims essentially undermines the character of that tradition. After admiring the glory of the Lamb for some time, I began to think of the situation my body was in, and rose up to return home. It would have helped me a lot to know I was not alone. I shared this source with Mike Quinn when he was writing _Early Mormonism and the Magic World View_. In these two episodes we discuss: The aftermath of the Mark Hofmann bombings, and Brent's excommunication for his research into the Book of Mormon, and Brent's review of challenges to traditional approaches to the Book of Mormon. Ive followed Mormon stories for several years now and listed to most of the episodes and this interview with Brent Metcalfe is in my top 5 MS podcasts. What historical issues does he think are most worthy of exploration, and how would he suggest young aspiring researchers go about gathering and parsing primary and secondary sources? Thank you as well for your research, especially your work on New Approaches to the Book of Mormon. This was an awesome interview. In Part 3, Brent discusses the aftermath of the Hofmann murders, including the trial and Hoffman's eventual plea deal. In Part 3, Brent discusses the aftermath of the Hofmann murders, including the trial and Hofmanns eventual plea deal. 2) It seems to me that most of the critiques in the 21st century arent recent developments, rather they already existed for sometimes decades (credit to Brodie and the Tanners for that). We had some technical difficulties. What was the arrangement and the special business relationship Steven had with the Church in this regard? Hearing Brent break down the Hoffman timeline and story was amazing. Doxey denied asking about Metcalfe. Im sure this applies to other beliefs as well. I understand the church spent large sums of money on BYU professors and private research to bolster the Book of Mormon claims through archeological discoveries.unfortunately they have not found what they had hoped for. :-) I really R E A L L Y loved the podcast, and will listen to it all again today. Brent Metcalf, age 31, Kingsport, TN Lived in: Greeneville TN, Elizabethton TN, Louisville TN Relatives: Terri Treadway, Kathy Edens, Douglas Metcalf View full report Brent E Metcalf, age 39, Semmes, AL Lived in: Wilmer AL, Theodore AL Relatives: Beverly Metcalf, Thomas Metcalf, Thomas Metcalf View full report Why do you think it is that the church is so fearful of discoveries such as the letters by Mark H ? Quote: More recent studies conducted by Professor of Anthropology Richard B. Stamps, of the Michigan Historical Museum, indicate that the artifacts were made with contemporary tools. I remember being troubled by the lack of divine discernment that the brethren have/had. Fantastic interviews. This was interesting all around. It seems to me that going with what you may think everyone around knows is right (even if it isnt) more easily allows for these kinds of experiences more than realizing there are differences of opinion and thought and then vying for spiritual confirmation. What would you say are the most significant developments in the critiques of the church in the past 20 years that didnt exist beforehand? https://egyptianalphabetandgrammar.blogspot.com/. Long question, sorry ! Brent Metcalf's last collegiate wrestling match was a highly anticipated one. The confessionals in the documentary of Hofmann's associates, such as Shannon Flynn, Brent Metcalf and George Throckmorton are captivating. Do you believe that your martial arts and mental training has contributed to your belief system and the independence from the crowd? "[10], Naifeh, S., & Smith, G. W. (2005). We should also mention that he has since been a key speaker at a conference hosted by Ex-Mormon Foundation and has given several interviews where he has detailed his lifes ups and downs. What did they accomplish by kicking any of you out? They use evidences such as paintings from the 1600s showing native americans using temple signs/tokens, apparent cuneiform writings being discovered that spell Yod Hey Va, and that the Hopewell/Adena Indians are the Nephites/Jaredites. [3] Current historians tend to agree that Scotford and Soper joined forces to sell the fake relics for personal profit. Theres the answer. When discussing some of the details surrounding the Book of Abraham, he mentioned the Tale of Onidas and Kitumen. I have never heard of that before and cannot find anything about it. I happened to not do soat least, not yet. Some suggest that energy-conservation constraints favored our thoughts sliding along low-resistance neural ruts that include simple feel-good narratives. Honestly, incredible work. They even go so far as to claim that Zarahemla was directly across the river from Nauvoo, and that the waters of mormon are Big Springs, MO. Years ago, I attended a book reading and signing by Jon Krakauer in Marin County when he was promoting Under the Banner of Heaven. Categories . hendrick motorsports hats; brent metcalfe excommunicated My question to Brent is during or after authoring/editing New Approaches to the Book Mormon, did he have other or similar spiritual experiences that confirmed the historical facts (which may be viewed as counter experiences to those earlier in the church)? And a small footnote: Many of these original founders had been part of an on-campus group, called the Open Door Club. We have to learn to get along and improve our conditions wherever we are and it is a much more difficult task because of all the varied belief systems prevalent in the world. Thats not necessarily a problem, of course. You didnt elaborate on that interpretation. Thank you both in advance. I can hardly wait for the rest! I just finished listening to part one and I loved it! I was pronouncing words instead of just reading them. Is there going to be a part 3? And if Christianity/Mormonism is *false*, then were being done a tremendous service in this falsification. My question is: please discuss this shift or emphasis away from evidences and honest research (study it out in your mind), to just feelings, in regards to determining truth. SALT LAKE CITY Egyptologist Ed Ashment sympathizes with Washington anthropologist for now has escaped excommunication from the LDS Church. His contributions, reflections, thoughts and insights represent some of the most important contributions in the history of not just Mormon Stories, but Mormonism in general. The lack of discernment all the way back throughout all the church history The lack of congruence among the leadership with such a claim as who they say is at the head! Thanks so much for posting this. Is it paramount to understand all of these religious histories and come to terms with them or, Brant for people like you and me, would it be better to turn our talents toward uncovering and deciphering Gobekli Tepe, a stone temple complex built 12,000 years ago at the end of the last ice age in Turkey, built by the Watchers of the Book of Enoch and the Anunnaki gods of Sumerian tradition? Many of the writers did become illustrious personalities, exactly as you point out. Thanks again Brent! The time has come to really dig in and discover our true human beginnings without religious bias. I do not have that ability as I actually changed an Economics major when I took my first accounting class. I devoutly attended BYU in the mid 70s. She spoke of her life and what has happened in the 30 years since one of Utah's most infamous crimes, Thursday October 8, 2015. I think that the Salt Lake LDS church is concerned with becoming the RLDS church, which has changed its narrative to a very noncompelling one, and about 80% of its members have left. Like I said they were casting that net as wide as they could get it. My examples are numerous and heart breaking. How did you encourage this masterpiece which, in my opinion, decimates the churchs past claims on the BofA? Billy Hibbard, for instance, who became a Methodist preacher, recounted: I thought how happy must Jesus Christ have been when he suffered for sinners. It is his sixth season overall with the Cyclones after serving as the volunteer assistant for the 2017-18 season. This theory is now well accepted in academia. Ive always wondered why the most ardently orthodox and pious seem to have the least faith in the divinity and omnipotence of the Lords plan. Don't miss. I've debated whether or not I should write about this, as I'm well aware the reception may be inflammatory, however it's something I'd like to get off my chest. In 1994, Professor David Wright of Brandeis University and editor Brent Metcalf were excommunicated for their scripture studies in New Approaches to the Book of Mormon: Explorations in Critical Methodology In 1995, author Janice Allred was excommunicated for her writings about Mother in Heaven. 515-294-6532. I may have a chance to look for it next week, but Im not promising anything. But it has not always been that way or worked in his favor. Examples would be projects at the Serpent Mounds in Ohio, linguists studying things like Native Americans singing in a language that seemed close to Hebrew,archaeological digs in latin America that were obviously BOM related, etc. Yes! Thank you for sharing it with me. I could read fine in private but the social damage was done and anxiety overwhelmed me every time. Im not excited anymore. Unintended consequences here we come! [5][6], According to the Deseret News, the response from the apologetic community was "vitriolic. That was fascinating, thank you. Phooey to that. You know, guilt by association. The irony is, I wasnt an activist for anything, I simply wanted to write. She has become the matron saint of Mormon studies (that's a promotion from her previous role as the den mother of Mormon studies). I was a writer for 7th East Press. ), systematically undermining Church teachings on the law of chastity and the . Growing up I only had positive interactions with his beautiful wife and kids. Heres a link to the Deseret News write up on the presentation: https://www.deseretnews.com/article/865608559/BYU-professor-speaks-on-unnoticed-assumptions-about-the-Book-of-Abraham.html. Good clarification, Doubting Thomas (if that is your real name), :) I have no reason to believe that Jerald Tanner attempted official contact, so Im not sure who Darrick is referring to or what the method of communication entailed. My application of Vatican II was specifically intended for the work of Catholic biblical scholars, not Catholicism in toto. It is better thought of by non-Catholics (generally), but this has not translated into conversions or retention of cradle Catholics. by Brent Metcalfe November 24, 2014 14 Comments Jan Shipps is the perfect inaugural interview for the Mormon Studies podcast. Im curious who is singing Lead Kindly Light in this its beautiful. John Dehlin Faces Excommunication. Priestly and monastic vocations have dropped through the floor, sexual abuse has skyrocketed (its not just that it was always happening but was exposed recently, it is pretty clear that sex abuse itself has gone way up post Vatican II), church attendance is way down, retention rates among youth have plummeted- one could go on. He eventually concluded that the document was not an actual historical account and compiled a book of essays suggesting the same, entitling it New Approaches to the Book of Mormon: Explorations in Critical Methodology, published in the 90s. Do you still attend LDS church? Iowa's Brent Metcalf wrestles with Iowa State's Mitch Mueller during their 149 pound match Friday, March 19, 2010 in the quarterfinal round of the 2010 NCAA Division 1 Wrestling Championships at . Now, along with all of the other historical and literary problems, including DNA evidence, we are suppose to accept it on feelings and the spirit.like all religions do with their own faiths.and be excited about sharing this book with our friends! I discovered New Approaches to the Book of Mormon back in 2002-03. The gift of your ADHD shines. Brent provided a detailed account of the Mark Hoffman story with a perspective that we seldom hear. Excellent question. Can you offer any insight to this? At one point John asks you if you think JS was putting together a scam or if you believe that he believed it himself. Two more parts (3 & 4) to come. I especially connected with his comments on ADD. It is something that has fascinated me, and this Metcalfe interview did not disappoint!!! As someone told him, You didnt have a crisis of faith but a Failure of Faith. Very informative. I went to BYU and graduated with honors but I did everything I could to get out of reading or to read beforehand what I could be asked to read out loud. Brent Metcalf was a bad dude in high school. No one believed that any one person could do all of those forgeries and build those bombs, and kill those people . And you are an example. Boy, what a chilling conclusion. Little trace of Morison survives for much of the early 1540s, but it is clear that he built up his landed base and attached himself to .
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